Culture critic Nicholas Quah and author Jael Richardson talk about the sisters’ new show that’s only on X

Sisters Serena Williams, right, and Venus Williams of the United States react to a point during their first-round women’s doubles match against Lucie Hradecka and Linda Noskova of the Czech Republic at the U.S. Open in Queens, New York City. (Jamie Squire/Getty Images)

Recently, tennis phenoms Venus and Serena Williams made the jump into podcasting with their new show, Stockton Street.

What makes the sisters’ foray into the podcast world so unique is that unlike most shows, theirs is available exclusively on X — the social media platform formerly known as Twitter that’s seen a marked rise in antisemitism and other forms of online hate since Elon Musk purchased it in 2022.

Today on Commotion, host Elamin Abdelmahmoud chats with culture critic Nicholas Quah and author Jael Richardson about what Stockton Street suggests about where we’re at with podcasting right now.

We’ve included some highlights below, edited for length and clarity. For the full discussion, including a conversation about the return of the podcast Heavyweight, listen and follow Commotion with Elamin Abdelmahmoud on your favourite podcast player.
WATCH | Today’s episode on YouTube:

Elamin: The Williams sisters have a podcast. What did you think of them entering into the space?

Jael: I mean, I’m a little wary of celebrity sports podcasts. I say that, and I have to caveat that I am also a devoted 92%er. I love New Heights…. I’m losing all credibility as I speak. But the reason, I go back to storytelling and the way stories are told. First of all, I want to give pause. I thought it was super awkward, but I also would never watch my first podcast. I think the first New Heights podcast was awkward. So I’ll give them newness, as a forgiveness. They need space to grow. The premise is confusing for me in this launch, though, because they’re sitting in velour chairs on the floor of Arthur Ashe Stadium talking, and there’s no structure. They don’t have notes. They’re just chatting. You hear them overlapping over each other. They’re asking questions that I would have asked my sister the day after it happened, not 10 years later. I don’t understand the framing.

What worked for New Heights, what worked for the Kelce brothers, is that they have this dynamic that is literally electric: one of them just rants and goes off on wild tangents, the other one just laughs hilariously at them. And then they tease each other about their childhoods, which one the mum likes more. It’s just a constant hilarious banter. And so you watch for that, you watch for the guests. They also benefited from starting this podcast and then facing off against each other in the Super Bowl the first year they did the podcast. Not to mention, soon after that Travis started dating the most famous musician in the world. And so they’ve had both their personalities to go with them, and these big moments, and they also have incredible podcast structure. They have segments that they do, they have bits that they do, they have things they do in the off-season and the on-season. There’s a production level to it that is kind of overlooked often, because they’re such great characters. But that’s what this is missing for me. It’s missing a clear sense of structure. They’re retired, so are we going to talk about their partners? Are we going to talk about their families? Are we going to talk about their businesses that they’re starting? What’s the draw? … They don’t have a dynamic that I think is really warm, either, and I think that’s where this first awkward episode emerges.

Elamin: Stockton Street, ostensibly named after the street where they grew up in Compton, California, so the idea is you’re getting them in a slightly more intimate setting. What do you think of this podcast, Nicholas?

Nicholas: I mean, the question there that Jael was pointing out, it’s true…. Like, what is this show about? Because if we talked about New Heights, the premise of the show — yes, you go for the banter, that’s what keeps you there — but the structure of it is tethered around game coverage. It’s structured around stuff that’s happening in the league. It’s a little bit outside of their life, and when they do talk about their lives, that’s where the sauce comes in. It’s a little bit of the magic of it. Stockton Street seems to be in part about them, right? You feel the structure to be like, “Oh, this is where we can speak freely about ourselves, our lives,” and things like that…. Is the reason that I’m tuning in because I’ve always been interested in something about Serena or Venus’ life?

But within the frame of this show and within the stature of who these people are, the thing about Travis and Jason Kelce is you don’t expect them to hide a lot. They aren’t incentivized over their careers to be very close to the chest — such is the advantage of being a very big, burly white guy. But the Williams sisters occupy a different relationship to the culture. And so when this project comes out and the premise is that we’re going to actually see the truth, see some intimacy, see some authenticity, it’s a little hard to believe because they’re not working with an external interpreter that’s trying to get the truth out, which is … a little bit of why we need actual journalism that forces them to be alive. And in the absence of that, we have something like this, which you cannot feel like you can really trust, actually.